Why I love Opera [Khaki, Especially for you]

[nkaisare]

Most of this comes after being thoroughly influenced by
http://tntluoma.com/opera/lover/6/prelude/
A 30-day tutorial on features of Opera. Features that I myself use most of the time, but didn't think too much of them until now... and reading that website, I realize how much I get used to using Opera day by day.
(# = something I didn't think about too much until I read that in Tim's site)

[Note: a couple of these features, I didnt know they eisted]

Reasons to use Opera:
1. Tabbed browsing and MDI(multiple display interface). Opens new windows not as a different window, but as a different tab in the same browser window.
1.b. USER CHOICE: (#)
You dont like MDI, no problem. Easily turned off using preferances. You are in control of your browser!!
But really, once you get hooked on to tabbed browsing, you sill never go back to IE-style browsing.

2. Small size (3.2 MB), more stable. If it crashes, its just Opera thats crashed. Doesn't hang the entire system.

3. All the toolbars are completely customizable. COMPLETELY. Not just turning on or off, but also where you want to place them. For example, I dont like the status bar... I dont have one.

4. More key board shortcuts than IE or Moz. Best thing is that when you right-click, with the options, they also show keyboard shortcuts. Thats handy reminder if you forget the shortcut (#).

5. Mouse gestures http://www.opera.com/features/mouse/index.dml?platform=freebsd
They ARE addictive. I use [right-click]-[mouse down] to open new window in IE too :) not realizing that its Opera cool feature.

6. Easy to turn off images. To the left of the address bar, there is a button to show/hide images. You can show images, hide them or EVEN show cached images only (#).

7. Turning off Javascript using "Quick Preferances" (or F12).
Turning off unrequested popups using F12
Identifying as IE or Moz using F12 (#)

8. Search bar that allows not only Google/Yahoo search, but also searching sites like Amazon or Ebay. I didnt think of it much because I have google toolbar in IE too. But the mere fact that I can search even amazon and ebay and all those sites using the SAME search-bar in Opera is just AMAZING. Again, thanks Tim for opening my eyes :)

9. You can highlight a word and copy it in IE. You can highlight a word and copy/search google/search amazon/search dictionary/translate in Opera.
9b. (#) And something I didn't know/realize before, you can select word/sentence/paragraph and email only that part to your friend. No need to send entire page, just that part of the page you want him/her to read!!

10. Page zoom and not just text zoom. IE doesn't provide it at all. I hope later versions of Opera provide text zoom as well (like moz). But I definitely prefer page zoom to text zoom.

11. Better bookmark management.

12. Linked Windows (http://tntluoma.com/opera/lover/6/day18-linked-windows/) I didn't know it existed. But it does sound cool!!

13. Author Styles and User Styles. Also the selection of use styles to emulate text browser, table-less layout, etc is really very handy.

14. Cache control
http://tntluoma.com/opera/lover/6/day21-cache/
I didn't realize Opera's superior caching. But something that I did realize is I can clear only the visited urls without affecting the urls that I typed in (or vice verca).

15. IE HAS TOO MANY GODDAMN SECURITY BUGS (#)
http://tntluoma.com/opera/lover/6/day22-security/

16. Skins to change how browser looks and feels

17. Transfers folder. I guess PeOfEo found that annoying, but I just love it.

18. AND hey y'all ctrl+enter-to-add-www.-and-.com-in-IE guys
Opera has its own CONFIGURABLE Server name completion.
File > Preferences > Network and then select the box for “Server Name Completion”. In the panel you can select a prefix (www. or none) as well as (NOT ONE BUT SEVERAL) the suffix(es). So to try all the suffixes mentioned in the other thread... simply add (com,edu,org...).

Thanks Tim for a wonderful evening :)
I hope my advisor doesn't know of this site. Hez not going to enjoy the thought of me spending a whole day (and much more) on exploring Opera.

Ciao :)
Niket

[AdamGundry]

But what about Mozilla?

1. Yes
1b. Yes
2. Bigger than Opera, but still doesn't hang the system.
3. Just about
4. No
5. I use vi as my text editor. That says it all, really.
6. Yes
7. Not exactly, but very detailed JS/popup control.
8. Similar, but with different choice of sites.
9. Web search or view selection source (really useful).
10. Text zoom
11. I don't know what Opera's bookmarking is like, but Moz is good.
12. Weird
13. Not quite, but with a bookmarklet...
14. Mmm...
15. I agree completely.
16. Themes (Lo-Fi is cool).
17. Choice of download manager, progress dialog, nothing at all.
18. Internet keywords (similar in a way).

So that's it, IE people. Switch or die!

Adam

P.S. That's not to mention the multiple tab bookmarking, built in form/cookie/password managers, web development tools, sidebar...

[DaveSW]

The only down side to tabbed browsing is if Opera crashes you lose it all.

[Charles]

Originally posted by DaveSW
The only down side to tabbed browsing is if Opera crashes you lose it all. But then when you restart one of your options is to reload all of those "tabbed" pages.

[DaveSW]

yes - but it goes back to when you opened the browser ages ago - nothing to do with what was open when it crashed.

[Charles]

Originally posted by DaveSW
yes - but it goes back to when you opened the browser ages ago - nothing to do with what was open when it crashed. Quite to the contrary, it has allways taken me to the very pages that were opened when the crash occured. (I have a terrible habit of opening up too many pages while several of them are loading.)

[DaveSW]

It never works for me. I'll crash with mpcomputersdirect.com, this forum, yahoo, and a few other sites and reopen with just the a1surf forum from when my brother was using the pc.

Strange

[Charles]

What version are you using? I seem to remember that happening with 6.

[DaveSW]

from the about page
Version 7.10
Build 2840
Platform Win32
System Windows ME
_
Java Sun Java Runtime Environment version 1.4

I actually downloaded it a while back when you recommended it to someone and said it was fast. I was having trouble with IE pausing before loading pages, so I downloaded it. I've never had any other trouble with it, and it is a lot faster than IE. Maybe it's windows ME.

[PeOfEo]

Originally posted by nkaisare


17. Transfers folder. I guess PeOfEo found that annoying, but I just love it.
Your right I hate that folder! But I dont like the way opera handles a lot of scripts. My page can look just awesome on mozilla and ie and look like curd on opera. Ill give you a link to a template I made and you can see what I mean. http://knights.europe.webmatrixhosting.net/temp/index.html I just switched servers and this is only a temp so there is a possibility that I will get a 404 or two but thats because I have not gone into my code yet. But look how ie and mozilla are and then look at opera. I just looked at it one image is not going to display. Also while you are looking at that temp dont criticize it lol, I was told to use nested tables okay. I am learning css though I sware, I have a pretty good (i think) layout already and I am going to make a few more.

[pyro]

Originally posted by PeOfEo
My page can look just awesome on mozilla and ie and look like curd on opera.You're page doesn't look "awesome" on my version of Mozilla (1.2.1)... Also, in IE, there is a one pixel shade difference between the background (51,51,51) and you images (52,52,52).

[PeOfEo]

Humm they are supposed to be the same color oh well, its not like anyone is using that temp. But when I say looks awesome I am talking about the layout of it. Opera is rading differently and everything gets moved around and I get unwanted spaces inbetween elements. But ie and mozilla are not reading the script that way. As you can see it all fits together. Oh nevermind the reason you are sing the difference is because that image does not exist anymore. Thats a path problem because I changed servers. Ill change the path then you can view it again in its former awesomeness :D

[Charles]

Take a look at the rather long list of HTML errors - http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fknights.europe.webmatrixhosting.net%2Ftemp%2Findex.html&doctype=HTML+4.01+Transitional&charset=iso-8859-1+%28Western+Europe%29. What do you expect a good browser to do with a bad page?

[PeOfEo]

Charles, its picking out errors for things like the fact that I used a font bullet and the html validator is using a different font. Okay. These things are not going to affect the layout changes I saw in opera that I am specifically commenting about. Also the error messages were about too many -'s in my comments. I tend to use a lot because they also server as makers. I can only see one legitimate error that could possibly cause a problem.

[PeOfEo]

also pyro I uploaded the bg.png which was not in that directory so Now we can go back to why opera causes layout issues.

[jeffmott]

its picking out errors for things like the fact that I used a font bulletThat accounts for 5 of 37 errors. There are *many* other problems. I went through and fixed your errors and it now displays properly in Opera. So we're back to Charles' question: "What do you expect a good browser to do with a bad page?"

[PeOfEo]

Jeff the other errors happen to be the fact that I use too many -'s for my notes. Would you kindly tell me the proper number I will change it and we will still see the problem still exists. Also the errors that this validator is picking are because of the fact that this is a table basted layout. Well that is unavoidable because I was told to make a table based layout for this. The erros have nothing to doo with the fact that opera reads my code differently then ie and mozilla and if you will view my site on opera and then mozilla you will see then center I frame shifts about half a cm. Also if opera is a so called 'good' browser then shouldn't it read my code very similarly to mozilla which I am sure none of you will dispute the fact that it is a good browser.

[spufi]

Actually using a table based layout has little to do with making a site valid. One can make a W3C valid site using tables for layout.

[PeOfEo]

I dont know why its picken up tr's and td's but the fact that mozilla and ie display the site like it is supposed to be displayed and opera does not is the point I am trying to make here. Opera is reading the code differently.

[jeffmott]

the other errors happen to be the fact that I use too many -'s for my notesThere are still more errors than that accounts for. If you'd have taken the time to even count them then you'd realize that. You do need to put in a little effort here.Would you kindly tell me the proper number I will change ithttp://www.w3.org/TR/html401/intro/sgmltut.html#idx-HTMLAlso the errors that this validator is picking are because of the fact that this is a table basted layoutAs spufi already mentioned, you can have a table based layout and still pass the validator.Also if opera is a so called 'good' browser then shouldn't it read my code very similarly to mozillaYou also have no doctype, which means that all the browsers are interpreting in quircks mode. So every browser is left to inperpret your page in whatever way each one chooses.

You have style elements and basefont tags in the body. These belong in the head and any browser following the HTML specification is free to ignore them. You'll also notice this line<table border="0" align="center" background="./bg.png" valign="top" width="700"
cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" bgcolor="#333333"Note there is no closing >.its picking out errors for things like the fact that I used a font bulletYou do realize that using a character entity instead of the actual character would fix this right up?

[PeOfEo]

I dont know why I would do that. I mean what would be the point because its just as easy to do it the way I had it. I dont understand exactly why that would be an error. Ill put a doc type on it but I doubt it will change how opera views it.

[PeOfEo]

Ok fine, I altered the code and corrected all but one error. I dont know why It is saying that a table css does not have a background attribute because without it I get the 1 pixil difference because I did not use a websafe color for the images or something like that. Anyways I went throug systematically and whiped out numerous errors. Now finally do what I said VIEW THE DARNED THING IN MOZILLA THEN IN OPERA! Then you will see how mozilla reads my code differently then all of the other browsers it has been tested on (I also took a look at it on some versions of netscape and older versions of ie on some different platforms, opera is the only one standing out) This might just be a fluke of some sort but I dont know Ill let you be the judge of that one.

[jeffmott]

what would be the point because its just as easy to do it the way I had itTo what are you referring to here?I dont know why It is saying that a table does not have a background attributedurr, maybe because TABLE does not have a background attribute... :eek: HTML 4 Transitional Document Type Definition
<!ATTLIST TABLE -- table element --
%attrs; -- %coreattrs, %i18n, %events --
summary %Text; #IMPLIED -- purpose/structure for speech output--
width %Length; #IMPLIED -- table width --
border %Pixels; #IMPLIED -- controls frame width around table --
frame %TFrame; #IMPLIED -- which parts of frame to render --
rules %TRules; #IMPLIED -- rulings between rows and cols --
cellspacing %Length; #IMPLIED -- spacing between cells --
cellpadding %Length; #IMPLIED -- spacing within cells --
align %TAlign; #IMPLIED -- table position relative to window --
bgcolor %Color; #IMPLIED -- background color for cells --
%reserved; -- reserved for possible future use --
datapagesize CDATA #IMPLIED -- reserved for possible future use --
>This might just be a fluke of some sort but I dont know Ill let you be the judge of that oneYour problem comes from floating (align) both iframes where you don't need to. Remove those and Opera will display fine. Ultimately, the entire page seems far more complicated than it should be and fairly disorganized (e.g., you're constantly switching between nested tables and the use of colspans).

[PeOfEo]

Well the thing about the iframes was my point here. Opera and mozilla are reading it differently. That is what I was trying to point out this whole time! It doesnt have much to do with that site which I made a while back for some people as a temp and they though it was boreing and wanted something 'flashyer'. The site its self does not matter I just wanted to show you how the browsers are reading that differently and I said in my first page dont focus on my code or the site its self just notice how it is read differently. Not in those words of cource.

[jeffmott]

just notice how it is read differently. Not in those words of courceIn fact your words were, "My page can look just awesome on mozilla and ie and look like curd on opera." With this sentence you implied that Opera was reading your page incorrectly. Thus me and a few others pointed out that you were feeding Opera a page full of errorsOpera and mozilla are reading it differently. That is what I was trying to point out this whole time!If your point was that browsers render pages differently then this is very old news and probably why this is not what people interpreted your post to mean. But thank you for now clarifying your post.

[PeOfEo]

I mean I corrected the errors but opera is not displaying how I want it to be displayed but mozilla and ie do. Opera just is not doing what I want it to and its the way it handles I frames. Its a defficience in how it renders pages. Thats all im poiting out. But not just that I just never liked opera. Its the only browser I really do not like I guess of the browsers that are used today.