Kevin Mitnick advises not to use IE

[drhowarddrfine]

Paul Thurott says IE is a cancer on the web.
CNET says don't use IE.
Now Kevin himself says Avoid hacker-bait apps like Internet Explorer (http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,72116-0.html?tw=rss.index)

[scragar]

everyone on these forums already new that though.

[drhowarddrfine]

Sometimes we can use a little help when others say how wonderful IE is and they see no reason to change browsers. From a user's viewpoint, there doesn't appear to be anything wrong with IE but for those of us who have to code for it, it's the worst browser on the planet.

[scragar]

I've persuaded about 5 people in the past 3/4 weeks to make the switch, but still some people think that IE is the only thing you can use online.

[drhowarddrfine]

Remember when web developers thought IE was the only browser to design for? (Like just last year)

[Jick]

I've been trying to convince my family to use a better browser (e.g. Firefox, Opera) but they just don't seem to want to listen. My mother, in particular, seems to think IE is better because Firefox doesn't work for some of the sites she likes to visit. I've tried explaining to her that it's bad proprietary coding but she doesn't understand that. She doesn't understand that because some jagoff developer coded the Website specifically for IE, it doesn't work in other browsers very well.

Maybe I'll convince her some day... :p

[drhowarddrfine]

Show her that link and tell her "The guy that hacks the corporations and banks you visit is warning you not to use IE!"

[Ed_Ryan]

I, my family, and some close friends already shifted from IE to FF. I've been using FF for almost wo years now.

[Reli4nt]

As per M$'s plan continuing to use IE is simply more convenient to millions of users that switching to Firefox. Understand that most users don't know how any part of their computer or the web works, or care to. They just want to check email and find the site they are looking for.

People simply can't be bothered to use whatever isn't already in front of them. If FF can find a way to be readily on hand like IE then most people would probably switch. Until it is more convenient to use FF, FF will always be a distant second.

[drhowarddrfine]

If FF can find a way to be readily on hand like IE then most people would probably switch.I still haven't found out what happened with that because the Justice Department supposedly ordered MS to separate IE from Windows.

[Speedle]

IE is useful but there are a lot of viruses in it.

So I use Opera.. nice too.

[felgall]

A couple of years ago one of the local computer mags asked which is the odd one out from a list of browsers (some of which were rather obscure ones) and then gave the answer as being IE saying that it was just a major security hole in your system while all the rest were web browsers. Of course that was referring to the 600+ unpatchable security holes in IE6. Maybe the antivirus or antispyware software producers should update their search to identify IE6 since it is the biggest security risk you can have on your computer. Alternatively firewall programs should block it automatically and not allow it to be unblocked (at least that solves the security problem with IE for older systems that can't reduce the security holes by upgrading to the long outdated IE7.

[LeeU]

I still haven't found out what happened with that because the Justice Department supposedly ordered MS to separate IE from Windows.

Once the Bush administration came into office, the order from the Justice Department was revised and "relaxed" somewhat by John Ashcroft and Bush.

[scragar]

the only good excuse for using IE is to download firefox, and even then I wouldn't recomend doing so because IE is so unsafe...(I always carry a firefox installer(for windows, cos thats the most common operating system) on my pendrive while I'm near someone elses computer, just in case)

[The Old Sarge]

everyone on these forums already new that though.

No they didn't.

[dera]

ie7 isnt that bad, its a life saver compared to ie 6, the general public isnt missing out on that much anymore

[Reli4nt]

it is much better but if ie6 were a boat with 10 holes and ie7 a boat with only 3, then i would think "isnt that bad" still sucks.

[KDLA]

It's all a matter of visibility. If Firefox made deals to have it installed on every PC in every store out there, people would use it. But, it isn't.
Thing is, people are scared to download programs that don't come with their PCs. Of course, they'll download all sorts of screensavers/wallpapers with spyware attached, but when it comes to functioning major-impact programs, they steer clear of them. They don't want the responsibility to "maintain" them, or the blame when one of them screws up everything else.

Then, as pointed out, things look different in Firefox. They think it's the browser's fault, something messed up in a "hopeless" program that ultimately needs uninstalling. Really, you have to cut these people a break: there are web designers here that don't even know about cross-browser compatibility. How is Joe Visitor out there supposed to be aware of it, when 50% of the web developers out there don't?

[scragar]

It's all a matter of visibility. If Firefox made deals to have it installed on every PC in every store out there, people would use it. But, it isn't.
Thing is, people are scared to download programs that don't come with their PCs. Of course, they'll download all sorts of screensavers/wallpapers with spyware attached, but when it comes to functioning major-impact programs, they steer clear of them. They don't want the responsibility to "maintain" them, or the blame when one of them screws up everything else.

Then, as pointed out, things look different in Firefox. They think it's the browser's fault, something messed up in a "hopeless" program that ultimately needs uninstalling. Really, you have to cut these people a break: there are web designers here that don't even know about cross-browser compatibility. How is Joe Visitor out there supposed to be aware of it, when 50% of the web developers out there don't?
if thats the case then 50% of web developers are also completely oblivious to the rules of standards and properly use something like frontpage to whip something up quickly that looks good in IE. And those people are not web developers, in fact I doubt if you could even call them armatures.

and I perfectly agree that firefox would get used a whole lot more if it was on people PCs to start, but Mozilla is a non-profit organization, they cannot afford to go making deals with money that they don't have.

[the tree]

IE is useful but there are a lot of viruses in it.Just came across this post... what the hell? Obviously IE doesn't come with any viruses, that'd be all types of illegal.

[kiwibrit]

......... My mother, in particular, seems to think IE is better because Firefox doesn't work for some of the sites she likes to visit..........

I have some sympathy for that viewpoint. There are some sites I use (for example, a French bus timetable) that will not work in Firefox. So, even if I did not need IE to check my web coding, I would need it for sites like that. It is not the average user's problem the IE can be a pain for coders.

[russell]

if thats the case then 50% of web developers are also completely oblivious to the rules of standards
standards aren't rules.

[KDLA]

Just came across this post... what the hell? Obviously IE doesn't come with any viruses, that'd be all types of illegal.

I guess he/she means IE is susceptible to viruses. But, really, any PC is susceptible -- I'd guess that 75% of viruses are caused by user neglect, by opening suspect email or downloading programs, rather than viewing a website with that particular browser. It may be that, that type of user, who downloads unsecure programs or opens email attachments from unknown senders, is also someone who uses IE.

[chad101]

A virus writer will always stick with the majority. If the majority was FF it would have the same problem as IE. FF is open source, IE is not.

If Linux dominated the PC market then the scenario would be switched. Every current anti-windows extremist would be crying “Use Windows!…Linux sucks”

Also open source applications, pc or server sided on the market are prone to exploits. When you can see the un-compiled code for yourself some very nasty things can happen. As more users switch to FF the exploits will come. I remember using FF about a year ago and making a comment to a friend about how great it was to surf the internet without the annoying pop-ups and other disturbing ads. Now they come much the same way as they did in IE.

FF has holes to. Also, end users should be educated on malicious social engineering. 95% of the problem lies with the end user and common sense, not the application.

[drhowarddrfine]

If the majority was FF it would have the same problem as IE. FF is open source, IE is not.

If Linux dominated the PC market then the scenario would be switched. Every current anti-windows extremist would be crying “Use Windows!…Linux sucks”While that would seem logical, there was a book written on the open source movement which gives some proof that this isn't true. One of the reasons is open source is created by the collective "we" but there were many other facts stated which I don't recall.
I remember using FF about a year ago and making a comment to a friend about how great it was to surf the internet without the annoying pop-ups and other disturbing ads. Now they come much the same way as they did in IE.According to Secunia, there are 111 vulnerabilities in IE compared to 35 in Firefox. Firefox is under continuous repairs to these while MS is uneven in their response. Some of the Firefox vulnerabilities are only on Windows due to an interface to a Windows problem and not something Firefox created.
When you can see the un-compiled code for yourself some very nasty things can happen.For some reason I can't remember the response to this but making the code visible has actually helped defeat those who would try and crack it.