Click to See Complete Forum and Search --> : IE8 beta2 is out
drhowarddrfine
08-27-2008, 05:53 PM
Download IE8 beta (http://www.microsoft.com/ie8)
I'm using it right now. The cursor isn't displaying correctly (outside the textbox).
IE8 beta2 is still 10 years behind web standards. (http://www.w3.org/2003/02/06-dom-support.html)
Three web sites I work with worked fine in IE6/7/8beta1 with hacks but this beta2 messes up some navigation that worked fine before.
Another gripe is this incessant asking if it's OK to run a script when I try and insert a link.
wh666-666
08-27-2008, 06:48 PM
Rather you than I.
Last time i tried to use IE was the IE7 beta. God that really annoyed me and i swore, "never again".
drhowarddrfine
08-28-2008, 09:52 AM
So the first reviews are out: (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080828-ie8-beta-2-shows-microsoft-is-serious-about-playing-catch-up.html)
Internet Explorer has fallen a long way behind Safari, Opera, and Firefox. IE7 brought the much-needed tabs, but was still a long way behind the competing browsers. And honestly, even IE8 hasn't caught up with the competition. But it's a great deal closer than I thought it would be. The standards compliance is certainly still a big issue, and the reality is that IE8 still won't be nearly as good on that front as the other three major browsers.
drhowarddrfine
08-29-2008, 08:34 AM
Microsoft breaks interoperability promise. (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/08/29/hakon_lie_ie8_interoperability/)
This week, the promise was broken. It lasted less than six months. Now that Internet Explorer IE8 beta 2 is released, we know that many, if not most, pages viewed in IE8 will not be shown in standards mode by default. The dirty secret is buried deep down in the «Compatibility view» configuration panel, where the «Display intranet sites in Compatibility View» box is checked by default. Thus, by default, intranet pages are not viewed in standards mode.
WebJoel
08-29-2008, 09:46 AM
M$ gnaws... :mad:
FYI: Microsoft Issues Warnings on IE 8 Beta 2 (http://www.internetnews.com/software/article.php/3768401)
WebJoel
08-29-2008, 04:46 PM
Unbelievable!! Hey did'ja all see that latest "Hi I'm a Mac/Hi I'm a PC" commercial??
"PC" is dressed as a Nobel King and admits that 'his subjects' complain about his OS, but he still reigns King, and "Mac' says that if anyone brings their old 'pc computer into any Mac store and buys a new Mac, they (Mac) will transfer all your files onto the Mac, for FREE!
Kingly PC if of course, crushed, -and waves his sepulchre at Mac and proclaims "You're BANISHED! I Banish you!" :D
I'm tellin'ya, -it's enough to make ya WANT to run out and buy a Mac!
Declan1991
08-29-2008, 05:01 PM
I'm tellin'ya, -it's enough to make ya WANT to run out and buy a Mac!
However bad Microsoft are, I would never buy a Mac. I've used one, and not only did I not like it, but they make you pay for so much.
However bad Microsoft are, I would never buy a Mac. I've used one, and not only did I not like it, but they make you pay for so much.Agreed.
WebJoel
08-29-2008, 11:40 PM
Or switch to all-LINUX :D
drhowarddrfine
08-30-2008, 09:54 AM
I don't use a Mac but Iwish Ihad one. At both my son's colleges, everyone's "next laptop" is going to be a Mac, which falls in line with what I've read about notebook usage in colleges.
When I worked at Silicon Graphics, everyone used Macs for everything. I believe it's still true today.
WebJoel
08-30-2008, 06:36 PM
I'd own a Mac (if I could afford one.) :)
wh666-666
08-31-2008, 05:39 PM
However bad Microsoft are, I would never buy a Mac. I've used one, and not only did I not like it, but they make you pay for so much.
Yea paying for it is a ballache but you've gotta love resource management on mac compared to windows.
Ive never brought a new mac but ive have a old imac (tv series :p) and a clamshell mac laptop for ages! Both are still solid machines after all this time and most importantly free when work was upgrading their mac's.
The clamshell mac laptop is very impressive, ok its only 300mhz cpu, but its battery life is still over 2 hours after all these years. On battery power, it even gives my eeepc a run for its money.
Anyway i digress. I agree with you that macs arent worth their blingy fashion price tag, however they are vastly superior in hardware quality, before anyone even argues about OS's.
drhowarddrfine
08-31-2008, 09:37 PM
That's the fact I've read a few places, that Macs actually come out even compared to Windows in price because the hardware and software always works together so time is saved or something or other. I don't know. The first thing they gave you when you worked at SGI was your own Mac. There were plugins everywhere and every cubicle had one over multiple buildings so someone thought it worthwhile.
cridley
09-01-2008, 07:31 AM
Anyway i digress. I agree with you that macs arent worth their blingy fashion price tag, however they are vastly superior in hardware quality, before anyone even argues about OS's.
Surely now that macs are intel based, the hardware is exactly the same, the quality of a pc depends on the quality of the hardware you buy so this argument flies out of the window. The hardware is the same (open up a mac) so what you are paying for is the apple logo (same goes for hdd iPods which are just toshiba hard drives wrapped up in an apple box). It's the brand you're paying for. Apple will not let you install OSX on your own hardware so they can rip you off with their propietary overpriced bog-standard third party hardware. They don't make their own hardware, they assemble it from exactly the same components as most OEM PC manufacturers.
wh666-666
09-01-2008, 07:59 AM
Not at all. This argument never flew out of the window. Apple plastics and many other components like input devices (keyboards, etc) are far superior and harder wearing than OEM pc parts.
Even business grade PC systems dont come anywhere close in matching Apple's quality. So what, both systems feature an intel e8400 for example, that doesnt constitute by any standards a similar system. To say that cosmetics and durability doesnt matter in computer plastics couldnt be more incorrect.
They do have many system parts manufactured for them exclusively, so you couldnt be more wrong.
cridley
09-01-2008, 09:03 AM
so you're saying the keyboard is worth the money alone? uh-huh.
wh666-666
09-01-2008, 09:39 AM
Im saying the durability of the entire user aspect is. Keyboard was just one example, but lets compare a macbook laptop to a laptop from a different manufacturer like HP. The entire plastics, lid catches, hinges, mousepad and keyboard and sleek asthetic appeal is far better than any other competitor.
As for durability of the hardware, the only other hardware ive seen matching mac is the ibm thinkpad series (lenevo) ..
I would pay the extra £200-£500 for a product that is less likely to suffer breakdown problems, more resistant to hard wear and has been designed to please the users eye for the lifetime of the product.
drhowarddrfine
09-01-2008, 10:10 AM
wh666 is correct about the durability and quality of parts because they are made by one company (and Apple does manufacture its own hardware). There is no concern about 3rd parties. Also, there is the guarantee the hardware will work with the software.
drhowarddrfine
09-01-2008, 10:40 AM
Speaking of which:
How Apple can increase market share (http://arstechnica.com/articles/culture/opinion-apple-os-marketshare.ars)
cridley
09-01-2008, 10:54 AM
Fair enough, durable cases (though I've seen (admittedly older) mac books break and warp spectacularly, I'm sure those are exceptions).
What I'm saying though is the hdds the ram the graphics card the chips etc.. the internals basically are just as prone to failure as they are on pcs, as they are the same. Maybe a mac provides more protection to its internals if repeatedly dropped so fair play to that, especially for notebooks etc, but I don't tend to drop my desktop machines so much really. You're paying for the quality of the box not the computing power or component quality, which I guess for some might be a good trade off, but which for me personally is not.
drhowarddrfine
09-01-2008, 11:46 AM
The main point of what I've read is the reliability of the hardware and software working together and that's where the price differential becomes a level playing field.
What I'm saying though is the hdds the ram the graphics card the chips etc.. the internals basically are just as prone to failure as they are on pcs, as they are the same.They very well may be but it's possible they're not. (I started life as a hardware engineer.) A manufacturer can buy "select" chips from the same part number and pay a premium for that. While a PC running Windows may use a processor from Intel, a Mac using the same processor may be of this "select" bunch that has better timing and was tested better, preselected, and all that jazz. The same is true of all integrated circuits.
I don't know that Apple does that but I do wonder.
webdevil99
09-01-2008, 11:50 AM
Great! Time to see how many different ways to break it!
wh666-666
09-01-2008, 01:24 PM
While a PC running Windows may use a processor from Intel, a Mac using the same processor may be of this "select" bunch that has better timing and was tested better, preselected, and all that jazz. The same is true of all integrated circuits.
I don't know that Apple does that but I do wonder.
I believe they do on some hardware, however it doesnt always work as companies hope.
I seem to recall, but correct me if im wrong, a while back Apple had selected seagate drives for a certain generation of macbooks, however they had massive amounts of failures. The worst thing was, due to Apples OS copying method, if the drive failed while copying content, which happened alot, that content was permanently lost.
drhowarddrfine
09-01-2008, 03:06 PM
... if the drive failed while copying content, which happened alot, that content was permanently lost.
Yes. When drives fail, the content is permanently lost. :rolleyes:
Obviously you mean something else. From an originating drive? Or what?
wh666-666
09-01-2008, 03:19 PM
What i mean is, from what i was aware, although this could do with clarification:
If you move (cut) a file from one folder to another in windows, windows will copy the file in to memory buffer, past it in the end location and then delete the original.
I was sure that mac copied the file in to the memory buffer, deleted from the original location and paste it in the final location.
If you suffered a hardware failure during this process on a mac it would make data far harder to recover. Just trying to look on the internet though and clarify this ...
Declan1991
09-02-2008, 04:23 PM
I wouldn't mind if that's all the extra you were paying for. But even when you get you're shiny box, you can't even get the new software upgrades because they are limited to the newest version of the OS. So you're laptop might last longer (in my experience not, but I'll take your word for it), but it will be outdated pretty quickly.
If I'm incorrect, please correct me, I have limited experience with Apple's software.