ajax away, seo ok

[rnd me]

interesting article: http://www.seroundtable.com/archives/019119.html

says msn, google already search ajax-only content.

most to follow soon.

i guess we can disregard all the SEO trash talk about ajax harming placement.

Google uses incoming links a lot more than actual content anyways, so i never considered it a particularly strong argument, but it's nice to see it formally die.

comments?

[A1ien51]

Can a user with a screen reader be able to use your web application?

Eric

[Kor]

Well, technically it would not have been a great deal, as there is possible to do and analyze a cross-domain request. Interesting is that they did it :)

This note rises a more important talk about: have client-side languages (javascript in particular) a future or not?

A lot of server-side oriented coders have been continuously diminishing the importance of javascript. Their arguments were of two kinds: accessibility and SEO. Lately both OS (and browsers) and displays seem to have been improved their accessibility performance; these days some javascript applications are to be interpreted, a way or another, even for people with disabilities, thus one of those two bulwark is about to cease. Now it appears to be the turn of the SEO lack of penetration argument to be demolished. Nice :)

[Kor]

Can a user with a screen reader be able to use your web application?

Eric
If well formatted, probably yes:
http://adactio.com/journal/1277/

[rnd me]

i think javascript can improve accessibility, not hinder it.
you can always examine the source of applications written in javascript.
this has led to rather intelligent tech that can analyze javascript like it does html.
accessibility people know all about xmlhttprequests, just like we do.

but the main point: screen readers use the dom.
if it's there to see, it's there to speak as well.

in the early days of html, javascript, and jscript, yes, scripting could interfere with assistance technology. bugs, table-based layouts, and <font> tags did little to help.

but these days, i don't think it's a such big deal.
the kind of partial-page refreshes and information-on-demand DOM modifications are easily detected and handled by screen readers.
in fact, incoming data and dom mod events provide a time-based clue about what's important that static pages never could.

dom mutation events, extensions, and the open source movement, have really helped to make firefox the default go-to browser for disabled users.
i don't have any numbers to share, but my sense is that it's the strong majority.
no doubt firebug played some part as well...

anyways, script away accessibility ok!

[A1ien51]

Where I work, 508 is a big deal.

Most of the libraries [that produce controls] out there fail big time with screen readers. YUI is getting good and so is Dojo. JQuery add-ons really depends who coded them.

EXTJS is one of the worse. Try to listen to their grid in a screen reader and your ears bleed. Nested table after nested table. :)

Personally I really would not want to trust that some AI bot is smart enough to be able to crawl my page and make sure it hits everything I need it to see. With a small amount of effort, it is easy to make it work without JavaScript and I know there are cases when it is basically impossible! I have those too.

Eric