@-Domains - a new concept about to break

[Julian2]

Below is a copy of a letter sent to all ICANN accredited registrars.

The concept of including an @ in domain name is something I have been working on for three years. I think the industry will start to take this idea on board soon.

It is much too much for me - a technophobe - to take much further. I am looking for allies - particularly small internet comanies with the where-with-all to create either @-domain brands or a mini-ICANN

Because I was the earlybird I captured many of the key @-domain families.

The letter below is self explanatory

09 01 04



Dear Sir/Madam,

Some ICANN registrars (following my previous letters) have plans to start selling domains which include the @ symbol. I calculate this change will extend the number of names available in the .com format by more than one third.

See this link to understand that domain names can include an @ symbol http://www.pc-help.org/obscure.htm.

The implication is that if your client wants www.CarRental.com and it is not available you could offer them the alternative choice of www.C@rRental.com. ( @-Domains can have multiple e-mail addresses and in every other way function like traditional domains, they also offer you loyal customers which can not be poached (see my previous letters))

I am supplying this information because when many ICANN registrars become involved any market resistance to the idea of using the @ in domain names will be quickly overcome.

@-Domains and @-Domain Families

This letter concentrates on an aspect of the market called “@-Domain Families”. @-Domain Families give the registrar exclusive control over sections of the target market.

Traditional domain :www.CarRental.com
@-Domain: www.C@rRental.com
An @-Domain Family is all domains made from a single base unit – IE the base unit WWW.rRental.com has the @-Domain Family AnynameC@rRental.com

The following domains belong to one @-Domain Family.

www.UKC@rRental.com
www.DiscountC@rRental.com
www.Van&C@rRentals.com

Some families are very large. For instance www.ng.com ; Ng.com has a lot of potential clients because half the population of China have names ending in ang ( W@ng Sh@ng Y@ng etc). So the owner of www.ng.com could theoretically provide millions of .com personal website and e-mail addresses to the billions of Chinese citizens who own names ending in ang.

Another very big Family is www.Anyname&F@mily.com - since this could be the personal e-mail and website address for any English speaking Internet user.

Website address; JohnSmith&F@mily.com
E-mail address; JohnSmith&F@mily.com

Opportunities

There are two possibilities for the owners of the @-Domain Families.

1. Build a brand
2. Become a mini ICANN and share use of the base unit with other registrars

Build a Brand

The building a brand option entails buying a base unit – maybe www.B@byAlbum.com and then providing websites with templates. The owner can build a brand of B@byAlbum.com websites in a closed and controlled market.

The Mini ICANN

The mini ICANN solution is to sell domains to other ICANN registrars. For instance the owner of www.NG.com could sell www.LeeW@ng.com to another ICANN registrars who has a client called LeeWang.

This solution would involve setting up a “library of base units” which would operate as a sort of a communally owned ICANN. The base unit owners would be invited to place their base units in the library, and ICANN accredited registrars would have the ability to create @-Domains from these base units for a fee.

I think the company who sets up this service will become very important in the domain registration and hosting industry.

(The writer has a vested interest in setting up a library of base units because he owns 700 base units of many of the bigger @-Domain Families. Such as &F@mily.us G@llery.com &P@rtners.com T@ylor.com Fin@nce.Biz P@rtnership.com and 8% of the surnames of US citizens in the .US format EG J@ckson.us Cl@rke.us …etc - see at www.A-tails.com).

The Marketing Hump

There is a marketing hump to be overcome. It is not a big hump since the concept is only about making one more letter (@) allowable in .com Domain names.

The simplest marketing ploy is to add the @-Domain option in your search facility. For instance if a client asks for carrental.com – which is not available – your server could offer www.C@rRental.com as an alternative.

Your software could then sell the domain www.C@rRental.com without selling ownership of www.rRental.com. (It can be re-used in the library of base units).

If a number of ICANN registrars were to start registering @-Domains in this way the idea would gradually gain media attention and general acceptance. Domain investors should also be encouraged to buy these types of domains because they would have the energy and a vested interest in promoting the concept.

Marketing advantages

This is to forget the real marketing advantages inherent in the concept of @-Domains.

It is possible to use the & symbol in E-Domains provided the & is prior to the @; as in www.JohnSmith&P@rtners.com. This is much cleaner than www.JohnSmithandPartners.com

The concept also allows pairs of names John&M@rilyn.com (Chic)


There is an opportunity to progress clients from e-mail to web-site; for instance customers can be sold an e-mail addresses with message boards initially: You may sell the E-Mail address S@mSmith.com and then provide a message board at www.S@mSmith.com which is really a mini web site. Later, after the client has learnt how to operate the message board, the user could be progressed on to more complex personal website hosted by you.

The whole @-Domain concept makes the use of autoresponders more intuitive. For instance a gallery might buy www.BlueG@llery.com as a web site package, have an autoresponder service with details of opening times on BlueG@llery.com and an e-mail address at Sales.BlueG@llery.com - Each addition could be charged for and all would be hosted by your organisation.

As the concept becomes accepted there will be a land rush of investors and companies wishing to grab autoresponder addresses such as Don@ldDuck.com and websites www.Don@ldDuck.com or W@ltDisney.com

My Interest

I am a domain investor. I have been working on this idea for three years and already own some of the best @-Domain families. My interest is to see that this concept becomes mainstream.

This is the third time I have circulated the ICANN registrars with information. I know some registrars are interested and are working on software to sell @-Domains.

As a facilitator I am interested in helping you and adding my ideas. I am also beginning to circulate my ideas on to web site designer’s forums etc.

Microsoft

Both Microsoft and Netscape recognise the difference between www.UKC@rRental.com and www.DiscountC@rRental.com, however at present only the Netscape browser shows the letters prior to the @ symbol, Internet Explorer does not. This needs a patch. Does anyone have a good contact in Microsoft?

Please let me know of your interest and if you would like to work with me.

Julian@HisOffice.biz

END OF LETTER

Some predictions

1. It is going to happen quite suddenly because it is easy for registrars to set up, the concept will be attractive because it is very simple and .com and it will catch on because with use more advantages over traditional domains become apparent to users. Furthermore ICANN accredited registrars have a vested interest because they will make more money in this market than in the over-competitive ICANN regulated market

2. This land rush will be quite different to the release of new TLD’s because ICANN is not involved. The winners will be nifty investors who understand the system – followed by companies who will panic when they realise (too late) their brands and trade names can be bought up by investors and they have to pay through the nose to regain control.

When the market pans out the big winners (in order) will be:

1. Whoever sets up the mini-ICANN will be the all time winner.
2. The follow up will be the hosting companies who set up and control the best brands. (Things like anyname&P@rtners.com )
3. The smaller flexible registration companies who were early in place to accept registrations will do very well and build permanent loyal customer bases.
4. The domain investors who get in early and are wise in their decisions – for instance the owners of base nits for surn@mes.com and corporate ending like G@llery.com are going to be in a position to retire early. (that’s me in fact anynameTh@tsMe.com will be one of the winning brands for vanity e-mail and websites)

The losers will be the registrars who sit around thinking @-domains are a curiosity – often the big companies who think they know it all and wait on the sidelines will find themselves left permanently out of this market.



you can contact me

Julian@HisOffice.biz

[Jeff Mott]

Sounds like a silly idea to me.Both Microsoft and Netscape recognise the difference between www.UKC@rRental.com and www.DiscountC@rRental.comMake a very careful note: the host these two links point to are the exact same host. They are are the same domain, but with different userinfo prepended. Both will take you to identicle pages, which in this case consists of a JavaScript redirect. And since they would all be under the same host, each owner of these poor man's sub-domains would have to share FTP access (and password), server configurations, disk space, bandwidth, etc. In addition, the authentication contruct user@domain.com or user:pass@domain.com would be useless since a portion of this supposed domain is the user.The losers will be the registrars who sit around thinking @-domains are a curiosityI think the losers will be the ones that fail to realize that @-domains are not actually domains.

[pyro]

Since the @ is not a valid character for the host, I wonder just how you think this is going to work. The RFC 1034 (http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1034.html) (Section 3.5) defines the valid host (domain) name characters as this:

[a-zA-Z][-.a-zA-Z0-9]{0,61}[a-zA-Z0-9]?

(Though there must be a slightly later RFC, as this is valid):

[a-zA-Z0-9][-.a-zA-Z0-9]{0,61}[a-zA-Z0-9]?

Note: The RFC 1123 (http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1123.html) (Section 2.1) states the upper limit SHOULD be 255, but MUST be 63. I've chose to use 63, then, as my upper limit for domain name characters. Also note that these may not be 100% accurate. Read the RFCs and come to your own conclusions.

Also, with FTP urls, the @ is used to denote logins. For instance:

ftp://user:password@host.com/

[Julian2]

Am I really mistaken?

If you put in www.F@therChristmas.com in your brower it will take you to a web page

If you put in www.St@therChristmas.com it will treat it the same as to www.TherChristmas.com

I went through this with an ICANN accredited registrar in my home - and we found an explanation of what is going on at this link :http://www.pc-help.org/obscure.htm.

Netscape will show the full address: F@therChristmas.com in the browser bar and shows the difference in the way it is reading the different addresses

Microsoft takes the user to the differnet pages - but the browser bar only shows the portio of the address subsequent to the @ IE therChristmas.com in all cases. But it treats the address www.F@therChristmas.com as if it were a domain.

I am not technicallly minded - but to date nooe has told me otherwise - these addresses can be made to work like traditional domains.


If I am right it becomes more than a curiosity because it means that base units like www.rEntal.com control families of e-mail AND DOMAIN addresses. And that .com can be extended by include another one third.

I own www.Rrental.com so do not worry I am the owner.

E-MAIL ADDRESSES Would have to be treated differently:

The only difference is that the domain can not use the usual method for adding e-mail addresses. Jim@F@therChristmas.com will not work - it has to be Jim.F@therChristmas.com and Sales.F@therChristmas.com. In this way you can have multiple domain addresses.

To avoid spam it would be sensible for domains like www.W@ltDisney.com to use W@ltDisney.com as an autoresponder address because it is too guessable and Jim.W@ltDisney.com as a communications address. Otherwise the domain www.W@ltDisney.com works like www.W@ltDisney.com (Am I wrong?)


Julian

[Julian2]

On second reading I see Jeff is telling me something about sharing bandwidth and passwords

On ths subject I am out of my depth - but I understood that the browsers are using the pre-@ as a password - that is why it works. So I would like to know the forums opinion on Jeff's observations, I do not want to mislead anyone..


Julian

[Jeff Mott]

but I understood that the browsers are using the pre-@ as a password - that is why it worksMake no mistake that user info prepended to the domain is capable of taking the user to different pages, but they still will not be separate domains. There is far more involved in having separate domains than just making it looking different in the address bar. But I suppose this time I'll hold back on mentioning the technical reasons for this.

So, the final result, whether you believe me or not, is that what you propose simply will not work out. And if you continue to push and plan for it then you will only waste your time and money.

[Julian2]

Thanks Jeff

I am going to consult my programer for an explanation of what is going on and the limitations.

Julian

[Jeff Mott]

I don't mean to be harsh here, but, isn't that something you should have done before working on it for three years?

[Julian2]

Hi Jeff,

My programmer has set up an example and gives you this info about what he is doing to make it work.

Demo

www.Julian@HisOffice.biz
www.Jonathan@HisOffice.biz


A technical answer. Hope it helps.

For us to make www.dom@in.com work, we use a standard frame-based redirection.

A frame is an area (or number of areas) which contains information from somewhere else (a valid URL, local file, or remote server). Art is a Tart uses one with two areas (initally left area contains contents.htm, and right area contains main.htm (both on the local server)).

www.dom@in.com contains just one area which can be set up to point anywhere on the web. We have a special "local" option which uses the mailback files as the source.

The reason for doing it this way is that it was the only way I knew how, and still keep the www.dom@in.com in the address bar, while configuring the URL to show in the database. People with indepth knowledge of Apache server might be able to configure the server directly, by rewriting some internal code. I shall have a look at your link......

So, for the "remote" option (not mailback files), our server holds the URL to display for each individual www.dom@in.com. Anyone configures the files to display at that remote URL, and it costs us no resource (even the bandwidth is minor (the DNS lookup and they small bit of frame data).

eg.

Set up TheBestG@llery.com to point to www.freepages.freeserve.net in the update e-name section.
To change files update them at www.freepages.freeserve.net as required.
Set up TheGreatestG@llery.com to point to www.freepages.tiscali.net in the update e-name section.
To change files update them at www.freepages.tiscali.net as required.

It's not really worth another example - there are many already, like www.h@rry-potter.com, all the c@rrentals www.warwickg@llery.com (external to art-is-a-tart.com) juli@n-williams.com (external to tbm page on art-is-a-tart) etc, but if they really don't understand I'll do some more.

They are right that it's not a domain, but acting like it, the user doesn't know the difference.

I'll set up julian@hisoffice.biz tonight to point to www.twobadmice.com (to prove the point it's external).

All the best,
Jonathan

[Compguy Pete]

And how the heck are you suppose to say that domain name to someone else?

I would want to see the information from ICANN directly.

It also looks to me if this is on the up and up it's for people like yourself who buys odd misspellings of domains. Just my 2cents of course...

[Julian2]

It is pretty fundimental

What we are doing is putting www. in front of an e-mail address and it becomes a website address. How people use it is really a matter for the individual.

It is graphic - once seen never forgotten - but pretty difficult to say over the telephone. Unless you use an address like mine Julian@HisOffice.biz

Put www in front to make www.Julian@HisOffice.biz and click and you open a page in my company website. My e-mail address continues to work as normal.

My intuition is that it will be used by people who can not get the traditional alturnative. IE I can not use www.WaltDisney.com because it infringes copyuright, is owned by Walt Disney and I was too slow. But I bought ltDisney and set up www.W@ltDisney.com (try it)

You could give every member of your staff a message board on their e-mail address - perhaps you have no use for such a feature. Perhaps you have.

I like the idea of having an e-mail address that matches my name Juli@n-Williams.com and a personnal website at www.Juli@n-Williams.com (not set up)


From one base unit ng.com it would be possible to provide millions of Chinese names - LeeW@ng.com - maybe a gimmick - maybe not.

It works - it is for people to choose how they utilise it.

[PunkSktBrdr01]

I like this idea as an extension of email addresses. However, I don't think it is a very good idea as an alternative to regular domain names. Also, that idea of using the @ to replace an a is a bit confusing and annoying.

It would be a really good idea, though, for someone to make something like "personalweb.com", and then give people an email address and web site, like "me@personalweb.com", and "www.me@personalweb.com". Just an idea. :)

[Julian2]

thanks for the idea

Julian

[pyro]

Originally posted by PunkSktBrdr01
...and then give people an email address and web site, like "me@personalweb.com", and "www.me@personalweb.com".This could result in much confusion, as both are perfectly valid email addresses.

[Jeff Mott]

The problems I see are...

1) JavaScript used for the redirection, which would mean approximately 1 of every 10 WWW users will be unable to access any page behind an @ domain. However, this could be replaced with a server-side redirect. So this problem is fixable, but does still need to be fixed.

2) Frames. By using frames, users will no longer be able to bookmark any page within an @ domain except the homepage. They will also not be able to type in any path (e.g., no such path http://www.Julian@hisoffice.biz/file.asp?fl=cards.htm, that path can only be accessed with http://www.art-is-a-tart.com/file.asp?fl=cards.htm).

3) Server authentication of the form http://user:pass@domain.com would be completely unusable to all parties working under an @ domain.

4) The main reason domains are used to cover IP addresses is because domain names are easy to say and remember. However, one of the @ addresses (e.g., www.W@ltDisney.com) cannot be simply spoken. You would have to verbaly say WaltDisney (making a point of telling them that the www. is no longer optional). You then have to go back and mention that the A in Walt is not really an A.

Given the inherent problems, the @-styled addresses do not seem very practical. I really don't see this taking off like what you had forseen. My guess is that you would only recieve a small handful of customers, most likely made up of amatuers setting up a personal homepage (companies and organizations wishing to setup a professional site will probably find the drawbacks unreasonable). And even they may be hard to come by, since most people of that sort generally avoid spending money wherever possible (which is why they use hosts such as geocities).

[Julian2]

Thanks Jeff

Your reply is thoughtful and thought provoking.

I think the paths do work

It may be that it will work best with little package sites

IE sell a package of E-mail address: anyname@WeddingArrangements.com and little premade website for the user to fill in at www.Anyname@WeddingArrangements.com

Such a site could be very ephemeral since the user does not have to buy a domain name etc.

They could also be used by advertisers - taking customers to a home page after which you are in another site. They are not verbal - they are visual. Advertising is often very visual.

And they work as e-mail addresses - it probably is not your taste to have an e-mail address you can not say over the telephone. Probably you have a very different brain to mine - being a programmer you are proably really fast reader and very literate - I am a dyslectic artist - so visual cues work really well for me.

I like EricT@ylor.com - to my eyes it works better than eric234@Aol.com - but you can have both. So many of my friends can not remember their e-mail address - because they are like me internet dunces. But they know their own name

I think this concept will findit's niche, bigger than you expect, less than I hope!

Julian

[Julian2]

These are Jonathan's thoughts re points raised by Jeff

My, less enlightened, thoughts:

1) This is an issue. So far I cannot find a way of not using javascript (a linux guru might know a way of using a server-side redirect, but Steve and I couldn't find it). Also, the redirection can only be provided from a linux server (but we're setting it up, so does it matter?).

2) I believe this is fixable. I finally have enough info from the server to try it.

3) I've finally realised why this won't obviously work. However, I really don't understand what it does - it can't very useful as we never see it in any marketing - though I could pass on user:pass@julian@hisoffice.biz, it that were at all useful. Anyway, it's not the market it's aimed at.

4) Not true. You try explaining art-is-a-tart.com to anyone. Even cardsforyou.co.uk (is a 4, a 'u', ? etc.). It's about visual impact....

Am slowly recovering from the Scotland jaunt. I hope normal service will soon be resumed....

All the best,
Jonathan

Since posting this reply Jonathan has set up this demo

This now can take a file....

Try www.warwickg@llery.com/painting.htm - painting section, rather than www.warwickg@llery.com front page.....

Jonathan