Modifying script for someone (copyright question)

[Pittimann]

Hi!

Time to start my first thread here. The reason:

Two hours ago, I replied to this thread http://forums.webdeveloper.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=28927

pjk53, who started this thread, did not do anything wrong of course. He just described his problem. I went to http://javascript.internet.com/calendars/script-calendar.html, downloaded the stuff and found no hint, that this is a demo version.

I just modified the code to make it work without limitations (the calendar would only accept events for the first ten days of the month). Fortunately, I didn't post the modified code yet.

In the meantime, I visited the author's website and found out, that he sells the "unlimited" version for $45,- (I also found a newer demo version which I downloaded; the same limitation, just done in a different way).

My question: May I post the modifications here without breaking a law and without acting against the forum rules?

Any comment is welcome and appreciated!

Cheers - Pit

[Kor]

May I post the modifications here without breaking a law


My oppinion was always firm: JavaScript is an open source language. No law can stop me using, modifying or posting any javascript code. It's like mathematics... Who can judge me if I use a math operator calculation? Or if I use Riemann series? Riemann ?:D

Of course, it is a moral and correct to leave the author's comments, and, if modify, to mention who is the author of the genuine script, I always do so.

Well, about the Forum's rules... I don't know...

[Pittimann]

Hi!

Thanx very much for posting Kor!!

I was not that much afraid because of the legal part. Morally, I would say: it seems, the author wants to earn money with the script (which is his right). If I enable someone to save that money by using the modification, I prevent the original author from making that profit.

Maybe, one of the moderators or somebody else will give some statement concerning the forum rules' part of my question :p

Cheers - Pit

[Kor]

the author wants to earn money with the script


It is not the brightest ideea to earn money selling ready made scripts. Somehow it is like trying to sell the result of 2+2... :D

It is more likely to earn money writing specific scripts for specific clients with specific needs in specific web pages...

[fre]

*opinion only*

The technical legalities will depend on
1. whether he can copyright 'his script'
2. whether this copyright is valid where you are.

But:
1. I don't think scripts can be copyrighted (similarily how can you copyright HTML?)
2. I don't think it could be enforced even if it was.

so, i wouldn't worry about it.

[Pittimann]

Hi!*opinion only*Thanks - that's what I was asking for: comments, opinions, whatever.

Maybe my conclusions will make pjk53 happy :D

Cheers - Pit

[Vladdy]

Just because something is available, it does not mean it can be freely distributed. Just like you can not take a book from a library and publish it, say on the internet, without breaking copyright laws. If the author of the script has a note in the code that the script is copyrighted, it means that it's his intellectual property and it can not be freely distributed. If there is any doubt about the script, contact the author and verify the status of the script in question. Not only that is a moral thing to d obut also may save you legal troubles in the future.

[steelersfan88]

There is no law written anywhere that says "Thou cannot modify copyrighted scripts."

Leaving the Original: ... and website tags in their should be fine, in my opinion, as I did look at the code and saw these comment lines.

There shouldn't be a problem with it because it is very difficult to find a script on the Internet that is exactly what we need. If we wanted to make an adjustment, so let us. I don't see a problem with leaving the tags in.

No without the tags: In this case, I don't see a problem .. it never says anything about the tags staying in place, as I saw, but be safe and keep them. My opinion, of course.

[Pittimann]

Hi!

Thanks for your replies, guys!! :)

Actually, the script I originally was dealing with, consists of three files. Apart from instructions and version history, there is a "(c)2000" in just one of the (two) js files. Nothing else concerning how to deal with it.

If I was in need of a calendar script, I would write one myself. In the thread in question, somebody just asked, why the script he is using has the limitation, he wants to get rid of and there is nothing in the script's comments saying, that it is a demo version with limited functionality. On that basis, I would not have felt doing something illegal or (more importantly) immoral. That just came up after I went to the author's website. :p

Anyway - thanks again!

Cheers - Pit

[Kor]

"(c)2000"


That means nothing. I can write this too on the National Theater building, on on the pavement in front of Prime Minister's house... So what? To be able to use copyright, you must ASK and GET it from a national/international authorithy. In Javascript I don't think anyone will give the copyright bill to anyone.

[Pittimann]

Hi!

Thanks again, Kor!!

I think, I will just give the modifications I made to pjk53 and that's it.

Have a nice Sunday!

Cheers - Pit

[Vladdy]

Originally posted by Kor
That means nothing. I can write this too on the National Theater building, on on the pavement in front of Prime Minister's house... So what? To be able to use copyright, you must ASK and GET it from a national/international authorithy. In Javascript I don't think anyone will give the copyright bill to anyone.
You are so wrong, maybe because you confuse copyright with patents and trademarks. Here is a good article:
http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html
You are right about the (c) part though ;)

[Kor]

Sir, I am not as wrong as you believe. Whithout send you to the national/intenational agreements laws and bills, I must point out that, on one hand, you MUST enroll/register your Copyright product/firm before have the right to use (c) Copyright sign on your product / firms's name.

On the other hand there are limits in registering copyright products. An interesting line says about: " the singularity and genuinity of the product". That means you have to bring something genuine (a novel, a painture, a webpage design) to be able to be protected by the Copyright Act. No law will protect you if you insist that Pithagora's equation is your (c) and no une should use it just because you use it in some of your own calculation.

While a wab page as a whole, as a product, is a (c) subject, a javascript code can not be, as it has no self-value. The usage of a math calulation, language or rule can not be subject of copyright. I repeat, that is my firm believe and, as far as I have studied the European Laws in domanin, I might be right.

Math rules are strict, so, sooner or later 2 people could develop similar code lines, even they don't know one eachother's work.

A... you said once that "Just because something is available, it does not mean it can be freely distributed". But even the author freely distributes that script, as long as he put it on the public webpage, no password, no nothing.... It's a nonsense to put a javascript on a page and to ask money for him. If I give my books freely, on street, to the passing by people, how should I have later the impudence to ask them money later, and even based on (c) arbitrary inserted somewhere in the book???

[Pittimann]

Hi!

I absolutely agree with what you stated, Kor!

In the meantime, I submitted the modifications I was talking about to the thread in question.

My decision is mainly based on that:

I did not use the script with the full functionality, which the author wants people to pay for. The script I dealt with is freely available - it must have been the author himself who submitted it to different free scripts' sites (he offers this demo vesrion on his own site too).

Like I have mentioned before: when you download the script from javascript.internet.com, it is not even described as the demo version of something you would be supposed to pay for if you want the full functionality. The free script does not even "say" that there is a limitation built in.

I still am not sure about the legal aspects of all that, but as far as their logical consideration is concerned, I think just like you. Coming back to the moral point of view: by modifying that free script, I didn't do anything affecting my own moral :D.

The last point, form rules: nobody gave a statement on that. If I broke them I will plead guilty during my trial.

Cheers - Pit

[steelersfan88]

Not too mention that if you do live in Germany, there might be troubles to getting you to the origin of the programmer.

I think you did the right thing tho, I checked itout and if I had never visited his web site, would have never guessed it was a limited version, until of course I tried it myself!

[Pittimann]

Hi steelersfan88 and the others!

Thank you very much for your comments! :)

Cheers - Pit

[nbohr99]

The javascript in question is the ScriptCalendar software available at http://www.scriptcalendar.com

It is definitely wrong to modify and repost the authors work as well as a violation of copyright law.

[nbohr99]

The calender in question is at http://www.scriptcalendar.com

In fact, there is a license agreement on the website
http://www.scriptcalendar.com/dhtmlcal/calicense.asp