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Thread: Approach...Focus On Client?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    6

    Question Approach...Focus On Client?

    Like many, I'm trying to learn how to develop web sites. All of my ideas are dynamic / data driven web sites. Heck, let's just say something like a blog to start.

    I did a search and found lots of good information, but I'm still a bit confused. It could be that there are just so many options and ways of getting to the same thing (Photoshop syndrome), but I thought I would ask here and see if anyone would be willing to offer some guidance.

    I've got a decent handle on HTML and CSS (even if I have the design sense of a slug), and I work with SQL daily in my job; the web stuff is something I'm looking to integrate into my professional life.

    I've spent time with PHP and even a framework or two (Django msot recently). Those all made good sense, but it seems that things are changing. I never got so far to work with javascript, but I hear about it everywhere. I get the fundamental idea behind it, but research sends me in a zillion directions. AJAX, jQuery, Prototype, Knockout, SproutCore...even an article I read about Twitter's recent overhaul talked about how the new site was built around javascript. jQuery seems to be part of almost everything, or at least it works with everything. It's not clear where something like jQuery ends and a "framework" begins. Perhaps it's just not that clean.

    I like the client side idea, myself. If I were to take the approach of putting most of the functionality on the client side with some way to persist data on the server, what would be your recommended approach in terms of a basic learning path?

    I looked at SproutCore and liked what they had available, but -- maybe it's just me -- their documentation seems horrible.

    I'm comfortable with HTML, CSS, and even javascript as a scripting language. It might be that I should just start and hack away until I figure thigns out. I would be okay with that. But it would be nice to have a basic understanding of some good practices and the methodologies that are out there and supported.

    Books, links, or even just ideas I could look into would be very much appreciated. And I'll do my best to keep coming back and give back as I learn myself.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    121

    Some Deep Advice :)

    Hopefully you know about w3schools.com - if not, it's GREAT! It will teach you everything. Some of the most helpful information is in little 'blurbs' around the examples. Some people just skip to the examples, but if you start at lesson one, and read all the way through, you will do fine. It is really simple, easy and fun to learn.

    My suggestion: don't mess with jQuery. It helps sometimes, but it will detour you when learning the actual language of JS. JQuery is a JavaScript library, that is, someone put together a whole bunch of useful scripts into one giant file that can be accessed.

    Anything you can do in Jquery, you can do in JavaScript. And, you will go alot further with JavaScript.

    learn JS, and maybe even PHP before even thinking about JQuery. I am currently working on writing a 'book' about JS and HTML, but it is not finished and will surely never get published, but rather it is something I can give my students to take home with them. Trust me. Knowing JS will help alot. And visiting w3schools.com as a beginner is the best tool ever.

    The advantage to w3schools vs a book, is that there are actually live examples that you can edit. It is a much more "hands-on" experience.

    W3schools is free. I say try it out. If you encounter questions along the way, you can always ask them here.

    ------------
    http://www.w3schools.com/

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    6
    Thanks for the reply! I've covered some JavaScript, but I think I understand what you're saying about jQuery. It's probably a good idea to solve some problems myself with JavaScript...no substitute for slogging through.

    I've tried PHP and, to be honest I don't like it. It sure seems like moving are moving towards client side? Twitter, Apple...it feels right, if that makes sense. There are JavaScript frameworks that basically use the server for storage and not much else. Everything else is delegated to the client?

    This all is coming from someone who, while I'm not new to programming and databases, etc. Is the furthest thing from a web developer.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Versailles, France
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    1,270
    Javascript, PHP and textfiles seems the best way to make light sites...

    It's possible to build a very simple blog from a page like this.

    Building pages from the content or from the menu ? (See this pages)

    PHP is very practical when the structure of the page is done (but SPIP make too many loops)...

    While not building javascript files with PHP to preserve the server ?

    Ajax is not necessary you can load new script dynamically like on this page (see the source and the PHP code infra).

    Ligth pages are probably the future with new phones and tablets...

    Good luck. It's easier too ask questions as to build ...

    PHP Code:
    <?php
    header
    ("Cache-Control: no-cache, must-revalidate");
    header("Expires: Mon, 26 Jul 1997 05:00:00 GMT");
    header("Content-Type:text/javascript;charset=utf-8");
     
        if (!empty(
    $_GET)) {
        
    //    lecture du GET et execution des tāches 
        
    }
        exit(
    "alert('Votre adresseIP est : ".$_SERVER['REMOTE_ADDR']."');");
    ?>

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    121

    ...

    Now, would a moderator please move this to the PHP section so that people can search the forum an find answers.

    Thanks!

    Oh, and good luck to you!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1
    Thanks for the reply! I've covered some JavaScript

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    6
    The PHP forum. The initial post is about the idea of focusing on client side, not server side. And that's almost certainly going to be a JavaScript solution. There have been one or two recommendations for PHP, but I actually don't like PHP very much at all. I've tried it and it just doesn't feel right. No holy war intended, but PHP is not for me. And I think a lot of web development is moving to client side, like the new Twitter and frameworks like SproutCore?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    urbana, il
    Posts
    2,787
    why do somthing in php you can have to client do in js?
    if it's js, you get MP for free since every client runs the code, whereas php ques user workloads and does them one or two at a time...

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    121

    Question

    Quote Originally Posted by 007Julien View Post
    Javascript, PHP and textfiles seems the best way to make light sites...

    It's possible to build a very simple blog from a page like this.

    Building pages from the content or from the menu ? (See this pages)

    PHP is very practical when the structure of the page is done (but SPIP make too many loops)...

    While not building javascript files with PHP to preserve the server ?

    Ajax is not necessary you can load new script dynamically like on this page (see the source and the PHP code infra).

    Ligth pages are probably the future with new phones and tablets...

    Good luck. It's easier too ask questions as to build ...

    PHP Code:
    <?php
    header
    ("Cache-Control: no-cache, must-revalidate");
    header("Expires: Mon, 26 Jul 1997 05:00:00 GMT");
    header("Content-Type:text/javascript;charset=utf-8");
     
        if (!empty(
    $_GET)) {
        
    //    lecture du GET et execution des tāches 
        
    }
        exit(
    "alert('Votre adresseIP est : ".$_SERVER['REMOTE_ADDR']."');");
    ?>
    As others have pointed out, this was posted in JavaScript. We don't want to try to teach a whole new language here.

    I do wonder if this topic is still active. It seems that the question-asker hasn't dropped in for a while.

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